Book 5 - Prologue 29

Does this look like an ink blot to you?

Book 5 - Prologue 29
Comic - Book 5 - Page 29

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infiniplex wrote:
alowe wrote:
Null wrote:
Text can be enlarged without losing resolution, but images can't be, unless the fonts are embedded. Also, text can be read by a screen reader but images are more trouble.

In every update the text is an image. Try selecting a portion of it and copying it, and you'll see, it's all just an image.

It appears to have been that way since the end of Book 2. The last text update is selectable text, but the first epilogue is an image. As someone who likes quoting from the text, I also find it annoying. But, as spiteless points out, I don't have enough enthusiasm to do something about it, so my opinion doesn't count.

Yeah, the only time I find it awkward is when I'm trying to find a specific part of the story in order to quote it in some post, only to find it's not searchable. If you're just re-reading the current update then that's not so difficult. Just re-read it. But say you're trying to find a quote over several updates, that takes a while. But then I stick to the old adage, if it's important enough you'll put in the effort. If you don't want to put in the effort then it isn't important.

And I try to stay clear of expectations as I have an God given gift for chaos when that happens. Last time it resulted in a whole forum getting deleted in erfworld, lol. I try to be good and not start a culture war :lol::mrgreen:
alowe wrote:
But say you're trying to find a quote over several updates, that takes a while. But then I stick to the old adage, if it's important enough you'll put in the effort.

The transcriptions on the wiki are a lifesaver there. If you remember enough words of the text, you can just Google-search it, and it'll probably find the wiki page.
Lipkin wrote:
qTzal wrote:

There's "challenge the reader" from the standpoint of artistic, creative or story writing angles and there's "challenge the reader" from the standpoint of "you don't have a 4K resolution monitor so you don't deserve to read the content".
Also: the ableist apathy of including really poorly contrasting colors that are commonly confused by people with any degree of color blindness. Or blinking/strobing gif/flash elements causing migranes and/or seizures.

But hey! There are only two types of Erfworld readers: those who live and breathe the comic and the rest of us that have to come to the forum to figure out WTF is going on.

That's a rather harsh take that assumes the worst about Team Erf.

What "assumption"?

You might have had a point if this was the first time an Erfworld update was unreadable by those with colour blindness/poor eyesight, perhaps, maybe you could argue that it's not demonstrably a cause of apathy but instead caused by ignorance.

But it's not the first time this has happened.

This is not the first time I have to go into the forum because an update literally was not accessible to my eyes, which is a frustrating experience.

There's a point when apathy should not be confused for ignorance, where "mistake" becomes intention, and that's the point where the same people keep making the same uninclusive choices.
APersonAmI wrote:
Lipkin wrote:
qTzal wrote:

There's "challenge the reader" from the standpoint of artistic, creative or story writing angles and there's "challenge the reader" from the standpoint of "you don't have a 4K resolution monitor so you don't deserve to read the content".
Also: the ableist apathy of including really poorly contrasting colors that are commonly confused by people with any degree of color blindness. Or blinking/strobing gif/flash elements causing migranes and/or seizures.

But hey! There are only two types of Erfworld readers: those who live and breathe the comic and the rest of us that have to come to the forum to figure out WTF is going on.

That's a rather harsh take that assumes the worst about Team Erf.

What "assumption"?

You might have had a point if this was the first time an Erfworld update was unreadable by those with colour blindness/poor eyesight, perhaps, maybe you could argue that it's not demonstrably a cause of apathy but instead caused by ignorance.

But it's not the first time this has happened.

This is not the first time I have to go into the forum because an update literally was not accessible to my eyes, which is a frustrating experience.

There's a point when apathy should not be confused for ignorance, where "mistake" becomes intention, and that's the point where the same people keep making the same uninclusive choices.
Transcripts sound like a great idea. I'll get working on some of those myself, it's useful for those with visual issues as well as providing a searchable record.

There is a difference between accomadation and altering your product, of course. Erfworld is a webcomic. It's heavily visual by nature and the creators often make some relatively ambitious visual choices that most readers like myself seem to enjoy. That's not apathy towards the visually impaired, no more than an author who favors a flowery or complicated style of writing is apathetic to those who are only comfortable reading in a more direct fashion. They're producing a product, it might just not be right for you.

Don't keep on stopping by your local steakhouse and keep on getting frustrated by the lack of vegetarian choices. They're not carnivists or apathetic to you, they're just producing a popular product that you may not be a good fit for.
Caprice wrote:
Jaxad0127 wrote:
Power of other (?)ples sides

I'm betting it's "Power of other Temples' sides".

I had just assumed it was "other people's sides"
APersonAmI wrote:

What "assumption"?

You might have had a point if this was the first time an Erfworld update was unreadable by those with colour blindness/poor eyesight, perhaps, maybe you could argue that it's not demonstrably a cause of apathy but instead caused by ignorance.

But it's not the first time this has happened.

This is not the first time I have to go into the forum because an update literally was not accessible to my eyes, which is a frustrating experience.

There's a point when apathy should not be confused for ignorance, where "mistake" becomes intention, and that's the point where the same people keep making the same uninclusive choices.

I understand your frustration. I also have physical limitations that are not widely accommodated for in the world at large. However, just because you have had the same problem multiple times does not mean that Team Erf does not care. Complaining on the forums is not the same thing as contacting Team Erf directly. Furthermore, Erfworld does not include strobes, flashes, or blinks. The ads may, but Team Erf does not control the ads.

The steak house comparison is not a good one. Vegetarianism is a choice. But someone that is blind in one eye cannot watch a movie in 3-D. That doesn't make the existence of 3-D movies ableist.

This page was not the easiest to read, even without color blindness. This art style is still a work in progress.
Caprice wrote:
DukeofTuring wrote:
I can only think of two examples of Erfworlders self-croaking:

"Mad" Max cut his own Life thread with Wanda's help.
Wasn't that more of an experiment gone wrong that anything else? It's a confusing conversation, with Wanda and Isaac both hoarding secrets while also having very perspectives on magic, but seeing the two graves Wanda is leaving I thought it all was part of some effort to try and restore a croaked/uncroaked unit to life.

Wanda also both describes Maxwell as deliberately left to die by Olive and destroyed by his own thinkamancy, for what that's worth :?
Caprice wrote:
There's also (most likely) Archie Type who seems to have knowingly walked through his own portal.
"Archibald didn't know he would perish." Although I had forgotten how much Paige seemed to be toying with the idea of self-disbanding by portal when we first met her. I guess I'd write that off as the result of absurd levels of isolation and the bizarre passivity forced on her by Nestley's geography.
DukeofTuring wrote:


Wanda also both describes Maxwell as deliberately left to die by Olive and destroyed by his own thinkamancy, for what that's worth :?

That's not really a contradiction, as Wanda also said that he liked linking with casters while intoxicated. Basically, he linked with Olive, tripped too hard, and she didn't help him come down. Rather than croak slowly and painfully from withdrawal symptoms, he killed himself with Wanda's help.
Lipkin wrote:
APersonAmI wrote:

What "assumption"?

You might have had a point if this was the first time an Erfworld update was unreadable by those with colour blindness/poor eyesight, perhaps, maybe you could argue that it's not demonstrably a cause of apathy but instead caused by ignorance.

But it's not the first time this has happened.

This is not the first time I have to go into the forum because an update literally was not accessible to my eyes, which is a frustrating experience.

There's a point when apathy should not be confused for ignorance, where "mistake" becomes intention, and that's the point where the same people keep making the same uninclusive choices.

I understand your frustration. I also have physical limitations that are not widely accommodated for in the world at large. However, just because you have had the same problem multiple times does not mean that Team Erf does not care. Complaining on the forums is not the same thing as contacting Team Erf directly. Furthermore, Erfworld does not include strobes, flashes, or blinks. The ads may, but Team Erf does not control the ads.

The steak house comparison is not a good one. Vegetarianism is a choice. But someone that is blind in one eye cannot watch a movie in 3-D. That doesn't make the existence of 3-D movies ableist.

This page was not the easiest to read, even without color blindness. This art style is still a work in progress.


I realized that a part of the problem is that Erfworld appears to be a webcomic that is "consumed" individually when it actually is a 1,500 novel that the Erf reading community is reading through a chapter (page) at a time then meeting (these forums) to talk over:
    () WTF we just read
    () whether it is a masterwork
    () A fever dream
    () Or both.


If was just new or occasional readers I could accept the confusion about what is going on but even amongst the most dedicated Erf-fans the interpretive debates about what a single page "means" really point to Erfworld being more of a group entertainment exercise than the webcomic that it looks like from a distance.
Jade wrote:
He did notice [Sugar's mechanical significance], though.
As I've said before, I don't take Noah's statement to mean that Sugar should croak himself, primarily for the above reason. Rather, I took it to mean that Sugar either needs to adapt to the methods his Side uses, or step aside so he doesn't cause problems.

What I meant to get at was that Noah notices Sugar's significance in the earlier page, but then seems to forget/disregard that observation in this page. Given that Nestly existed before Sugar, I suppose it's reasonable to believe that Nestly will continue without him, but it's really odd to me that Noah doesn't even think about this conundrum when he's evaluating how to "deal with" Sugar.

I disagree with your interpretation for one crucial reason. Noah called Sugar a liability. As in; he is an intrinsically weak point that jeopardizes the survival of the side. If his very existence is the liability, there is only one way to remedy that. I take this whole conversation (when we now look at Page 30 as well) to mean essentially: "If you can't adapt your strategy/thinking based on the views I am about to explain, then you're a liability and need to disband." Noah is planting the seed FIRST, and then attempting the experiment to re-calibrate Sugar. If that experiment fails, ixne the etmple.